cosa spruzzano durante il deice

[bruno]

Ragazzi forse farò una domanda un pò stupida, ma cosa spruzzano sull'aereo quando a terra fanno il deice? vapore?

[Tixio]

No, niente vapore: ricongelerebbe, soprattutto in caso di sghiacciamento durante precipitazioni (nevose soprattutto).

Si usa una miscela (perlopiù riscaldata) di acqua e...vabbè, altra robaccia chimica che, tra l'altro, previene il ricongelamento. Dico "altra robaccia chimica" perchè non c'è un prodotto univoco ma ce ne sono diversi.

[Mach]

Cito da Wikipedia:

When there are freezing conditions and precipitation, it is critical that an aircraft be de-iced. Failure to do so means the surface of the aircraft's wings will be too rough to provide for the smooth flow of air and thereby greatly degrading the ability of the wing to generate lift, possibly resulting in a crash. If large pieces of ice separate once the aircraft is in motion, they can be ingested into turbine engines or impact moving propellers and cause catastrophic failure. Thick ice can also lock up the control surfaces and prevent them from moving properly. Because of this potentially severe consequence, de-icing is performed at airports where temperatures are likely to dip below the freezing point.

De-icing techniques are also employed to ensure that engine inlets and various sensors on the outside of the aircraft are clear of contamination caused by ice or snow.

De-icing on the ground is usually done by spraying aircraft with a deicing fluid such as monopropylene glycol, similar to the toxic ethylene glycol antifreeze used in some automobile engine coolants. Ethylene glycol is still in use for aircraft deicing in some parts of the world, but Monopropylene glycol is more common due to the fact that it is classified as non-toxic, unlike ethylene glycol. Nevertheless, it still must be used with a containment system to capture all of the used liquid, so that it cannot seep into the ground and streams. Even if it is classified as non-toxic, it still has negative effects in nature, as it uses oxygen as it breaks down, causing other life to suffocate. (In one case, a significant snow in Atlanta in early January 2002 caused an overflow of such a system, briefly contaminating the Flint River downstream of the Atlanta airport.) Many airports successfully recycle used deicing fluid, separating out water and solid contaminants in order to be able to reuse the fluid.

Though there are several different formulations of deicing fluid, they fall into two basic categories: Heated glycol diluted with water for deicing and snow/frost removal, also referred to as "Newtonian fluids", and unheated, undiluted glycol that has been thickened (imagine half-set gelatin), also referred to as "Non-Newtonian fluids", that is applied as an agent to retard the future development of ice or to prevent falling snow or sleet from accumulating. In some cases both types of fluid are applied, first the heated glycol/water mixture to remove contaminants, followed by the unheated thickened fluid to keep ice from reforming before the aircraft takes off. This is referred to as "a two-step procedure".

Inflight ice buildups are most frequent on the leading edges of the wings, tail and engines (including the propellors or fan blades). Lower speed aircraft frequently use pneumatic boots on the leading edges of wings and tail to affect de-icing in flight. The rubber coverings are periodically inflated, causing ice to crack and flake off in the slipstream. Once the system is activated by the pilot, the inflation/deflation cycle is automatically controlled. In the past, it was thought such systems can be defeated if they are inflated too soon; that the pilot must allow a fairly thick layer of ice to form before inflating the boots. More recent research shows “bridging” does not occur with any modern boots (ref: http://www.aopa.org/asf/publications/sa11.pdf).

Some aircraft may also use electrically heated resistive elements embedded in a rubber sheet cemented to the leading edges of wings and tail surfaces, propeller leading edges, and helicopter rotor blade leading edges. Such systems usually operate continuously. When ice is detected, they first function as de-icing systems, then as anti-icing systems for the duration of flight in icing conditions. Some aircraft use chemical de-icing systems which pump antifreeze such as alcohol or propylene glycol through small holes in the wing surfaces and at the roots of propeller blades, causing the ice to melt and making the surface inhospitable to further ice formation. A fourth system, developed by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration detects ice on the surface by sensing a change in resonance frequency. Once an electronic control module has determined that ice has formed, a large current spike is pumped into the transducers to generate a sharp mechanical shock, cracking the ice layer and causing it to be peeled off by the slipstream.

Many modern civil fixed-wing transport aircraft use anti-ice systems on the leading edge of wings, engine inlets and air data probes using warm air. This is bled off the powerplants and is ducted into a cavity just under the surface to be anti-iced. The warm air heats the surface up to a few degrees above zero, preventing ice from forming on that surface. The system may operate completely autonomously, switching itself on and off as the aircraft enters and leaves icing conditions.

[Tixio]

Io lo so di essere un rompib....lle, però non bastava inserire questo?

De-icing on the ground is usually done by spraying aircraft with a deicing fluid such as monopropylene glycol, similar to the toxic ethylene glycol antifreeze used in some automobile engine coolants. Ethylene glycol is still in use for aircraft deicing in some parts of the world, but Monopropylene glycol is more common due to the fact that it is classified as non-toxic, unlike ethylene glycol.

Che alla fine è...acqua e altra robaccia chimica!

[FAS]

PG e TTA
propylene glycol e tolyltriazole
il glycol in particolare é un composto organico appartenente alla famiglia degli alcohol.

[bruno]

Bhe si infatti l' alcohol non congela... grazie...

[duck44]

Aggiungo che a seconda della miscela e delle condimeteo hai un tempo limitato per decollare da quando INIZIA il deicing. In aeroporti sfigati dal punto di vista del freddo e con molto traffico le macchine con i bracci che spruzzano sono sostituite da una specie di enorme autolavaggio posto a cavallo della via di rullaggio sotto cui passi ad una velocità moderata. Questo per non rallentare le procedure di decollo.

[bruno]

ammazza... e il lavaggio glielo pagano?

[duck44]

Beh la tua è una battuta... ma non hai dea diquanto possa costare un deicing...

[alephuno]

il kilfrost costa all'incirca 5 euro al litro... fai un po te.

[duck44]

Appunto... immagina, non dico un 380, ma un normalissimo jet executive... Un pò di più de 10€ dell'auto lavaggio

[alephuno]

aahahaa
acqua e olio?? tutt'apposto??

beh comunque non viene spruzzato a mo' di autolavaggio, ci sono superfici critiche da trattare.

[Sinuhe]

No, niente vapore: ricongelerebbe, soprattutto in caso di sghiacciamento durante precipitazioni (nevose soprattutto).

Si usa una miscela (perlopiù riscaldata) di acqua e...vabbè, altra robaccia chimica che, tra l'altro, previene il ricongelamento. Dico "altra robaccia chimica" perchè non c'è un prodotto univoco ma ce ne sono diversi.

Robaccia chimica assolutamente contro Kyoto?tipo di quelle che ti fan stramazzare se la spruzzi in casa?

[beluga]

No, tipo quelle che metti nel radiatore dell'auto

[Tixio]

Robaccia chimica assolutamente contro Kyoto?tipo di quelle che ti fan stramazzare se la spruzzi in casa?

Kyoto non c'entra assolutamente nulla
Era un modo "simpatico" di definire prodotti certificati e testati anche circa la loro sicurezza. In aviazione c'è molto poco (forse niente) che non lo sia...Insomma, non pensiamo che ogni cosa che sia chimica sia necessariamente un'arma di distruzione di massa o quasi!

PS: tra l'altro le sostanze usate sono molto vicine a quelle che usi come antigelo in macchina..