Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

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Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da Valerio Ricciardi » 7 agosto 2020, 17:25

Primissimi lanci stampa su quotidiano locale online; risulterebbero purtroppo già due vittime e 40 feriti, i soccorsi sono in atto.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-ne ... 2ZOmJ.html

primi scarni lanci da noi (notare come nella pagina di apertura del Corriere della Sera inline il titolista si preoccupi di rimarcare che Air India Express sia una compagnia low cost, come se in sé rilevasse a priori)

https://www.corriere.it/esteri/20_agost ... eb3f.shtml

https://www.ilmessaggero.it/mondo/aereo ... 92544.html
"The curve is flattening: we can start lifting restrictions now" = "The parachute has slowed our rate of descent: we can take it off now!"
Chesley Burnett "Sully" Sullenberger

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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da JT8D » 7 agosto 2020, 18:01

Anche AvHerald al momento riporta non moltissime info, ma in costante aggiornamernto:

http://avherald.com/h?article=4daf960f&opt=0

I dati di FR24 confermano che l'aereo ha condotto un avvicinamento per RWY 28, ha effettuato un go around, seguito da un avvicinamento per RWY 10.

Paolo
"La corsa di decollo è una metamorfosi, ecco una quantità di metallo che si trasforma in aeroplano per mezzo dell'aria. Ogni corsa di decollo è la nascita di un aeroplano" (Staccando l'ombra da terra - D. Del Giudice)


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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da sidew » 7 agosto 2020, 23:34

Se ho letto bene i metar sul link di AVHerald, sembra che abbia tentato di atterrare con 12 nodi tailwind e pista in condizioni WET con pioggia....
Aldo

"Oops!" - Shannon Foraker, Ashes of victory

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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da JT8D » 8 agosto 2020, 20:40

sidew ha scritto:
7 agosto 2020, 23:34
Se ho letto bene i metar sul link di AVHerald, sembra che abbia tentato di atterrare con 12 nodi tailwind e pista in condizioni WET con pioggia....
Leggendo anche sulla rete, questa è una delle ipotesi che si stanno facendo al momento.

Paolo
"La corsa di decollo è una metamorfosi, ecco una quantità di metallo che si trasforma in aeroplano per mezzo dell'aria. Ogni corsa di decollo è la nascita di un aeroplano" (Staccando l'ombra da terra - D. Del Giudice)


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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da Lampo 13 » 8 agosto 2020, 21:52

JT8D ha scritto:
8 agosto 2020, 20:40
sidew ha scritto:
7 agosto 2020, 23:34
Se ho letto bene i metar sul link di AVHerald, sembra che abbia tentato di atterrare con 12 nodi tailwind e pista in condizioni WET con pioggia....
Leggendo anche sulla rete, questa è una delle ipotesi che si stanno facendo al momento.

Paolo
... e due...

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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da AirGek » 9 agosto 2020, 5:02

A meno che non abbiano toccato a metà pista come l’ASL a BGY o che la pista fosse più che wet quelle condizioni non erano tali da giustificare un overrun.
Tempi duri creano uomini forti,
Uomini forti creano tempi tranquilli,
Tempi tranquilli fanno gli uomini deboli,
Uomini deboli creano tempi duri

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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da JT8D » 9 agosto 2020, 14:17

AirGek ha scritto:
9 agosto 2020, 5:02
A meno che non abbiano toccato a metà pista come l’ASL a BGY o che la pista fosse più che wet quelle condizioni non erano tali da giustificare un overrun.
Esatto, questo sembra l'orientamento (chiaramente certezze non se ne hanno, sono le prime ipotesi che filtrano).

"On Aug 9th 2020 India's Aviation Ministry reported that according to testimony by the tower controller the aircraft did not touch down until abeam taxiway C (editorial note: about 1030 meters/3380 feet past the runway threshold) and anticipated the aircraft might overrun the runway and therefore instructed emergency services to enter the runway and follow the aircraft. When he did not see the aircraft at the runway end, he activated the crash button, tower instructed the emergency services to look down into the valley. The minister added also, that the aircraft had still sufficient fuel on board to divert to their alternate aerodrome and land there with more than minimum fuel required.

........

On Aug 9th 2020 a passenger seated in the aft cabin reported that following the go around the aircraft positioned for another approach and touched down, however, did not appear to slow down but to accelerate again. After touchdown the aircraft overshot the end of the runway and went down the cliff, all of that happened within 15 seconds. The passenger walked away from the wreckage nearly uninjured with just a bumped head and bleeding lips. He drove home by himself.

.......

According to ADS-B Data the aircraft had attempted one approach to runway 28 about 20 minutes prior to the landing but had gone around from about 2700 feet.

Kozhikode's runway 10/28 is 2845 meters/9330 feet long and features ILS approaches for both runway 10 and 28 as well as VOR approaches to both runways. In addition a NDB approach to runway 10 is published. Neither of the approaches have been NOTAMed unavailable. The runway sits on a flattened hilltop, a drop off of 35 meters/114 feet exists past the runway 10 end.
".

(http://avherald.com/h?article=4daf960f&opt=0)

Paolo
"La corsa di decollo è una metamorfosi, ecco una quantità di metallo che si trasforma in aeroplano per mezzo dell'aria. Ogni corsa di decollo è la nascita di un aeroplano" (Staccando l'ombra da terra - D. Del Giudice)


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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da JT8D » 14 settembre 2021, 21:16

E' stato rilasciato il final report.

Dal report: "The probable cause of the accident was the non adherence to SOP by the PF, wherein, he continued an unstabilized approach and landed beyond the touchdown zone, half way down the runway, in spite of ‘Go Around’ call by PM which warranted a mandatory ‘Go Around’ and the failure of the PM to take over controls and execute a ‘Go Around’".

https://avherald.com/h?article=4daf960f&opt=0

https://aaib.gov.in/Reports/2020/accide ... %20AXH.pdf

Paolo
"La corsa di decollo è una metamorfosi, ecco una quantità di metallo che si trasforma in aeroplano per mezzo dell'aria. Ogni corsa di decollo è la nascita di un aeroplano" (Staccando l'ombra da terra - D. Del Giudice)


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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da airplane » 15 settembre 2021, 5:20

AirGek ha scritto:
9 agosto 2020, 5:02

A meno che non abbiano toccato a metà pista come l’ASL a BGY o che la pista fosse più che wet
quelle condizioni non erano tali da giustificare un overrun.


.
>AirGek,
Non so e non ho letto nulla di questo incidente; Detto questo, Tu guardando la foto
del Power Stand dalla parte LH dei throttles vedi qualcosa oppure no?

Ovviamente, la Foto la devi vedere dal posto dove Tu sei seduto.


.

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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da AirGek » 15 settembre 2021, 8:12

Gli speedbrakes non sono armati... può darsi che abbiano tentato di ridecollare. Avanzando le manette la leva torna automaticamente in quella posizione.

Questo sembrerebbe corrispondere:

Passenger testimonies

On Aug 9th 2020 a passenger seated in the aft cabin reported that following the go around the aircraft positioned for another approach and touched down, however, did not appear to slow down but to accelerate again. After touchdown the aircraft overshot the end of the runway and went down the cliff, all of that happened within 15 seconds.
Tempi duri creano uomini forti,
Uomini forti creano tempi tranquilli,
Tempi tranquilli fanno gli uomini deboli,
Uomini deboli creano tempi duri

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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da AirGek » 15 settembre 2021, 9:26

Edit leggendo il report dice che le manette non sono state avanzate dopo la toccata e che la leva degli speedbrakes è stata manualmente avanzata quando l’aereo era già nell’erba.
Tempi duri creano uomini forti,
Uomini forti creano tempi tranquilli,
Tempi tranquilli fanno gli uomini deboli,
Uomini deboli creano tempi duri

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Re: Landing overrun B737 Kozhikode (Thread Tecnico)

Messaggio da AirGek » 15 settembre 2021, 10:38

Descrizione della dinamica e tra parentesi miei commenti.

At 14:09:41 UTC, the aircraft was established on ILS with autopilot and auto throttle engaged at a PA of 633 ft with a CAS of 150 kt, the ground speed was approximately 175 kt with a calculated descent rate of 750 fpm. .

At 500 ft AGL the autopilot was disengaged while the autothrottle remained engaged, [l’autothrottle andrebbe disconnessa prima dell’autopilota e in ogni caso non tenuta attiva mentre si vola in manuale] the pitch attitude was reduced and the descent rate began to increase, momentarily reaching 1500 fpm [sotto i 1000ft il rateo di discesa non dovrebbe eccedere i 1000ft/min]. The PM cautioned PF twice for high ROD, which was acknowledged by the PF for ‘correction’. The approach soon became unstabilized, wherein the ROD and glideslope deviation increased beyond the stabilized approach criteria. The aircraft deviated 1.7 dots below the glideslope [la deviazione massima non deve eccedere 1 dot]. This was followed by two EGPWS alerts (caution) for glideslope ‘glideslope... glideslope’. The PF increased the pitch attitude and the descent rate began to decrease, reaching 300 fpm before increasing again to 1000 fpm.

The aircraft crossed the runway threshold at RA of 92 ft [dovrebbe essere a 50ft] and was moving left of centre line with an actual tail wind component of slightly more than 14 Kt and a cross wind component of 6 knots. At this point speed began to gradually increase towards 160 kt CAS and sink rate was gradually arrested as additional thrust was being manually added despite autothrottle command to reduce thrust. [magari gli sembrava di essere basso] The engine power was continuously increased and reached 83% N1. This happened when the aircraft had already gone past the runway threshold by approximately 1363 ft and was at a height of 20 ft RA. The aircraft continued to float above the runway and moved towards the centreline as its lateral deviation was corrected. The engine thrust was reduced and at 3000 ft beyond the threshold, CAS began to decrease towards the approach speed at approximately 15 ft RA. During this time, 07 seconds before touchdown, while the aircraft was at 16 ft RA, the PM tried to catch the attention of the PF by giving a non standard call “Just check it”. At this point, the aircraft was at 2500 ft beyond threshold, 500 ft short of end of touchdown zone. At Kozhikode, end of touchdown zone is marked at a distance of 3000 ft from the threshold by the simple touchdown zone lights on either side of the centre line.

05 seconds before touchdown, the sink rate began to increase gradually towards 12 fps (720 fpm) as the nose was lowered and thrust was reduced. 03 seconds before touchdown, PM again tried to catch the attention of the PF by giving a feeble, uncomfortable call “...Captain” when the aircraft had crossed the end of touchdown zone (3600 ft beyond the threshold). During this time the engine thrust levers reached idle power setting.

Approximately 1 second before touchdown, while the aircraft was crossing 10 ft RA, at 4200 ft beyond the threshold the PM gave a call of “Go around”. [prima occasione utile quella puntatina a 1500’/min sotto il gate (1000ft), seconda il glide 1.7 dot sopra] There was no response from PF to the “Go-Around” call and he continued with landing. During the flare, the aircraft floated, which resulted in a long landing along with an extended flare of 16 seconds. The aircraft touched down at 4438 ft on the 8858 ft long runway [ben oltre la touchdown zone] with a CAS of approximately 150 kt and a GS of 165 kt. It was raining at the time of touchdown and the runway condition reported by DATCO was wet.

PF immediately resorted to max manual braking overriding the auto brake selection, auto speed brakes were fully deployed 1.2 seconds after touchdown extending the spoilers. PM gave the standard calls for “SPEED BRAKE UP” and “AUTOBRAKE DISARM” there was no response from the PF to the standard calls given by the PM as per SOP. Autothrottle disengaged automatically 03 seconds after touchdown. The thrust reversers were commanded to deploy 03 seconds after touchdown. [idealmente dovrebbe essere attivati entro 2 secondi dal MLG touchdown e prima del tocco del ruotino] They were deployed within 02 seconds after initiating the command and remained in that state for a brief period of approximately 02 seconds with both engines power increasing to 59%N1. [second detent corrisponde a circa 76% N1, quindi sono stati selezionati ma non tempestivamente utilizzati] There was no call from PM of “REVERSERS NORMAL” as per SOP. None of the standard calls given by PM were acknowledged by the PF.

Before the thrust reversers could take any effect, they were stowed back. [questo ha fatto rallentare il motore da approach idle a ground idle con conseguente allungo dei tempi necessari per erogare le necessaria potenza durante la seconda attivazione dei reverse] While the reversers were being stowed, the aircraft brake pressure was momentarily reduced, [con conseguente allungo della corsa] decreasing the longitudinal deceleration. This action by the PF coincides with a call by him of “shit”.

Thrust reversers were deployed for the second time 15 seconds after touchdown, when the aircraft was at 8200 ft beyond the threshold, max reverse thrust was commanded and the engine began to spool up. [se ricordo bene da ground idle a max rev thrust i motori ci mettono 14” a raggiungere l’82% di N1] Thrust reversers remained deployed for a period of approximately 07 seconds and by 9100 ft beyond the threshold (paved portion of RESA) as the CAS approached 60 kt, they were stowed back with the engine fan speed (N1) still high. [60kts è la velocità tipica alla quale si cancellano i reverse a patto che la fermata sia assicurata altrimenti possono essere utilizzati fino all’arresto dell’aeromobile]

Two distinct calls from the PF and PM of “shit” were recorded within a gap of one second on the CVR, when the thrust reversers were stowed again and the aircraft was about to leave the runway surface (paved portion of RESA) and enter soft ground.

Speed brakes were stowed back shortly after ‘SPEED BRAKE DO NOT ARM’
light came on. At this time, aircraft had travelled 105 ft in to RESA (soft ground). However, the commanded brake pressure was recorded on the DFDR till the recording stopped. At no stage, after touchdown, were the thrust levers moved forward at any time on the landing roll.

The aircraft did not stop on the runway and this resulted in runway overrun. The aircraft exited the designated end of runway 10 (8858 ft) at a ground speed of 84.5 Kt and then overshot the RESA, broke the ILS antennae and a fence before plummeting down the tabletop runway. The aircraft fell to a depth of approximately 110 ft below the runway elevation and impacted the perimeter road that runs just below the tabletop runway, at a ground speed of 42 Kt. Aircraft came to an abrupt halt on the airport perimeter road, close to the perimeter wall. There was no post accident fire. The impact caused the aircraft to separate into three sections and resulted in 21 fatalities including both pilots.
Tempi duri creano uomini forti,
Uomini forti creano tempi tranquilli,
Tempi tranquilli fanno gli uomini deboli,
Uomini deboli creano tempi duri

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